So I have a question for everyone regarding upgrades. I raced all but one of the Chi Cross Cup series and ended up 12th overall for the 4B’s. I was obviously going to move up to the A’s, but according to USAC I should move all the way to the 3’s? Comments and suggestions please.

Matt

Regarding road upgrade changes, and the point system in general...what’s the point?  Discretion throws it all out the window anyways--rules aren’t rules if someone can pick and choose when they apply and when they don’t.  And has anyone ever heard of someone being automatically upgraded?  I sure haven’t.

on the CX stuff, it’s a bandaid, not a fix.  CX is becoming more popular and while this will cut 4’s and grow 3’s field, as numbers grow, it just means 2 cats will be huge.  the fix is creating a 5th cat.

kevin c

“If the road and XC categories do not correspond to the same CX category, then the higher one will be used.” This means Cat 3 roadies can skip the Cat 4 cross races altogether.

does this ^^^ mean if i end up Cat3 in CX this year that i won’t have to be Cat5 on the road in 2009?

I write this in no way to offend anyone but I’d hate to think that simply because one is a 3 at CX or 3 on the road that qualifies them to race as a 3 in another category. 

Each discipline requires a unique set of skills aside from raw fitness and strength.  I’m a 3 on the road but for the life of me wouldn’t claim to have the skills to race CX or on the track… similarly I’ve seen track 2’s get onto the road and cause havoc.  I implore the USAC to reconsider this rule change.

Oh, and I’ve even seen officials notified with printed proof that a rider has surpassed the maximum allowed points for his/her category and still do nothing.  Memorial Day Weekend anyone...ahem...anyone…

Oh and San Dimas High school Football Rulez!  Wyld Stallyons!

I’ve seen track 2’s get onto the road and cause havoc.

What are you trying to say?

:)

Did you see the video of what happened at Cross nats?  Yeah, you can’t do any damage at all… right.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=32q1oJtNDrQ
bike racing is dangerous, period.

Ben

Can we all look past the one problem this tries to solve for a rider as an individual and think about the bigger picture.  How many new Cat1 CX racers will there be this year?  Very very few.  How many new Cat2 racers will there be this year?  Not many.  Yes, there is value in guys needing to work harder at it, but it makes it a slow process when you have a few guys all racing together who deserve the upgrade, but can’t get it because they are earning one or two points at a time.  Cat3 fields will soon start to experience the problems, bottle necking, scoring trouble and the wide skill set, that all come with a bigger field, even though the field size will never match what Cat4 groups are dealing with.  Cat4 races will STILL be in upwards of 60 riders.  (Lets not forget that the New England Verge series consistently has 100+ riders in their 4’s field) Had they just added a 5th field, it would have matched with both road and mountain bike categories and the 4s would be cut in half without trying to rush people into the 3’s group.  This isn’t going to discourage sandbagging any further because sandbaggers don’t care how qualified they are, they just don’t upgrade.  Thus awarding points to a smaller group is not going to help the riders behind the top 4 or 5. 

As to a riders abilities, riding with a sketchy rider is sketchy period.  Saying it is alright to be a total squirrel off the back of a cross race doesn’t make sense.  What happens when there is a sprint finish and the two riders are trying to work with passing someone in the deep snow.  Topping it off the rider they are trying to pass is all over because they don’t know how to ride in the conditions?  And with how points are working now, that finish might be a big deal for those riders.  And the sprint start, that is by no means slow, someone working the brake and not being confident about riding the wheel in front of them is going to be a danger.  Plenty of people get taken out and hurt racing cross.  Even further, as you upgrade, you are no longer riding 8-15 mph, it gets just a tad faster.  It doesn’t match the road, but the danger is there after you take the first pedal stroke.

Like I said on my blog, I think what Greg and the ChiCrossCup did with the addition of the Cat4b category was a great step.  Had USAC just followed that lead, then those riders would have had their own legitimate group (point, ranking, prizes) to work towards.

this conversation now warrants the use of a BO-2.
it’s just… there are CX specialists that take their sport just as seriously as the roadies, and to throw roadies into pro/1/2 races just because you’re less likely to break a collarbone seems off.  but rulez iz rulez and now we just gotta live with it.

Seth Meyer

For the record, perhaps you guys weren’t paying attention, but previous years’ rules allow road riders to ride one category below their road category in both track and cross. With Cat 1 and 2 roadies, this is an old topic; now you’re just adding road 3s to the mix.

But here’s the deal: Just because someone got some upgrade points in cross and moved up in cross alone doesn’t mean they’re not squirrely either. And just because someone hasn’t ridden much cross before doesn’t mean they automatically don’t possess the skill set yet (or maybe they didn’t, but they already built it from cyclocross clinics and practice.)

It boils down to this: You’re always going to have to deal with other riders of all sorts, regardless of any category restrictions. So stop arguing about other people’s categories all the time—that’s their business—and just race your race.

Seth Meyer

Speaking of racing your race, I think that if you’re undecided on your category—which is what this debate should really be about; don’t waste your time, energy, and brain power paying mind to others’ categories—I think the best way to go about it is to ask someone who knows your riding well and that style of racing well.

I race primarily on the road for Turin, but am looking into doing cross and track for the first time [seriously] this season. So I asked the Turin CX expert, Chris Dimmick, what he thought I should ride in cross, and Chris Mailing, what I should do in track. Together, we’re figuring it out.

Help and advice is out there. Go seek it. Just please, please, please don’t let other people’s blablablasandbagging blablablaupgradepointsblablabla someotheruselesscra pblablabla pressure you into make the wrong decision for yourself.

Ben is totally on target about the CX categories and I hope someone listens… Not only are road 3’s or new CX 3’s in for a big surprise but many cat 2 roadies will get their ass handed to them in the CX 3’s field their first season.

You have to learn technique, equipment, specialize your training, and figure out damn air pressures.

I do think that cat 1 SHOULD be hard to acquire. Back in the early 90’s I think we had a total of 200 in the entire country? That’s the way it should be. Of course i’ve been somewhat out of touch and USA cycling seems even more screwed up since the day, I’m not sure what 1 means any more… Remeber when you had to qualify for nationals by finishing well at districts?( or has it changed back)

I take offense to Julie (!) as I am a roadie who now loves CX and I totally respect the skillset! These guys can drill it like theres no tomorrow in the shittiest conditions… I’m amazed. I just hope they don’t wake up and realize they could probably hit the road and clean up!!!

Last thing… Stop getting hung up on category. Work with the district rep to get in the right category thats gonna help you develop skill and confidence… CONFIDENCE!

Is there anyone trying to help develop riders these days? I see alot of aimless people out here…

This is my first post… I feel dirty clicking the “post” button.... Here goes…

to get away from the CX discussion…

doesn’t anyone think that cutting the points in the crit races will make them that much more dangerous for the 4s shooting for 3?

Seth Meyer

The end of a crit is dangerous no matter what.