Power has detractors? Other than the initial cost of the hub, name them. Let the HR vs Power religious debate begin!

My coach recommends that people use a heart rate monitor first. Learn you body and what your body can do. after a couple of years of that, then get a power meter where you can refine what you already know into watts. For the average cat 3, 4, or 5 a power meter is not needed. They are great tools. Just my thoughts.

I raced three seasons without either one. Remember not to get too numbers-obsessed when it's time to pin yours on: Race the race, not the computer.

That said, I just recently invested in both a power meter and a heart rate monitor. Here are my thoughts on the matter, which I hope seem pretty straightforward:

A heart rate monitor definitely gives you a reliable indication of how your own engine is running on a day-to-day basis.

A power meter, especially when used to calculate power-to-weight ratios, gives you a good indication of how you match up to the competition.

A heart rate monitor will also reliably tell you what you can/can't do on any given day. Maybe you can't get up to your normal FT wattage comfortably one day, and you don't know why. Your heart rate monitor might show your pulse skyrocketing at lower wattages than normal—it would indicate you need some R&R, you're hungover, or whatever the case may be (a power meter, in this case, will probably just make you frustrated when you can't get back to your normally higher numbers).

A power meter will also more reliably show your progress over time. Maybe in January you could do a flat 10K time trial at an average of 240 Watts. Maybe in your peak racing form you could do one at 270 (or whatever). Likewise, maybe your peak power in winter is only 600, but 800 in summer. These are tangible statistics and means of measuring your progress.

Personally, I find that the power meter—and its inherent better quality of monitoring my progress—is more valuable to me. But I'm starting to enjoy using my heart rate monitor in conjunction with my power meter. (Most recently, it just let me know my pulse is skyrocketing when I couldn't get near the power I normally have. Conclusion? Even though you think you're over your cold, maybe you need a few more days away from the hard efforts yet!)

"For the average cat 3, 4, or 5 a power meter is not needed."

That is in fact the most asinine statement I've ever read.

"Learn you body and what your body can do."

The right tools will teach you, with precision what your body can do. As of yet the most advanced tool for cyclists is in fact a power meter.

That being said a typical week training for me looks like:

Sunday: Just roll around
Monday: REALLY hard
Tuesday: Kind of hard
Wednesday: Super duper easy
Thursday: KILLER hard (like, you know double REALLY hard)
Friday: Medium easy, but not Super easy
Saturday: A bit harder than medium easy but not as hard as REALLY hard but harder than kind of hard.

Dude I'm gonna tear it up in the 1's in no time!

There's certainly an argument to intuitively learning how your body feels in certain situation and at certain levels of output, and that's why the powertap shines at bringing a reality check to that feeling.

HR is swayed by dehydration, caffiene intake, lack of sleep, slow reaction to changes in HR, etc. Power doesn't care about any of that, and the power is near-real time (within a second or so) to changes in output. I believe this is even more important to the lower CAT racer than to the highly aware CAT 1 or 2.

Thirty minutes into your tempo workout, which is supposed to be 82 - 86% of your maximal HR/wattage you can maintain for 8 minutes, can tell by your HR that you are within that slim 4% range? I very much doubt it, but a powertap will tell you.

It's not a replacement for hard work, raw talent or tactics, but it will give you an additional tool with which to maximize your limited training time.

That is in fact the most asinine statement I've ever read.

Then you need to get out more. I totally agree with young John: Your first two years in the sport should be all about gaining experience and enjoying yourself. If I were still a Cat 4 or 5, nothing would suck the joy out of a good ride quite like a powermeter and the attendant number crunching.

Too much power obsession can make you numbers-smart but race-stupid. So you can do 400 jigawatts for 2 hours ... great. Then why'd you miss that jump? Why'd you get boxed in during the sprint?

Quantifying how you progress is a nice bit of trivia for your training logs, but it won't win you any races. So some can do n watts in December and n+150 watts in August ... big whoop. We still have to race. We don't just turn in our latest power chart at the registration table.

Again, I don't deny the utility of power+HR for the experienced rider ready to go to the next level. But for the beginning rider, a $100 HRM is the way to go. Spending $500 more for a powertap (or whatever they cost these days) is unlikely to yield five times the benefit.

And Billy: Please mind your manners here. I don't mind anonymous commenters and I don't mind people being rude ... but I take exception to people who are both.

Guys. Besides all the abowe (and below) which is the science of the race winning, THE MOST IMPORTANT purpose of all those tools is to make your eye/brain system busy (thank God) during those extremely boring winter training sessions...

The whole discussion started out about tools to maximize your training. Not tools to show you how to win a race. It's about making the most out of the time you are out riding your bike training for the race. Training is still fun with a power meter or a HR monitor. Which is a more accurate measure of effort? Powermeters win hands down. You don't have to pore over wattage charts after a training ride. I've never seen these charts, though I'm sure plenty are out there. Cycleops software calculates all that good info out for you after you download it from the cpu, just as polar does with min/max hr, time in target zones and so on.

A HR monitor or a power tap isn't going to win races for you, but they will both help to make sure you are in the best shape possible to try. Power obsession does not make you numbers smart race dumb. I'm sure some people obsess about hr numbers just as much as power numbers.

I'm not saying beginners should go out and buy powermeters, they are way more expensive then a hr monitor but if people are willing and able to spend the money then so be it. I do recommend hr monitors regardless.

I didn't train with a hr monitor until early last year, then got a powertap late in the season. I don't race with either, but I train with both.

Katie Compton trains based on perceived effort (no HR monitor or power). It seems to work pretty well for her.

That said a PT can be a great thing if you have enough money left over to hire a coach. Trying to analyze the data on your own can be time consuming for most racers who have a 40 hr/week job and a family on top of trying to squeeze in enough time on the bike to be competitive. A coach can help you analyze the data and maximize every minute spent on the bike.

Keep in mind that if you've got the money to blow on a full carbon custom bike, LEW wheels, and a gold-plated SRM, go for it...you'll just help keep the industry rolling. I agree that the average beginning racer probably would be OK with nothing more than a speedometer. There's so much to learn in a race, that the power and HR #s will just distract you and really are meaningless during a race. HRMs can be had for under $50 and are a good investment for someone who probably wants to get more serious about their training. However, most people would be better off spending their money on some type of guided training plan (whether book, online, or coach). I finally got my act together and am following a structured training plan rather than coaching myself for the first time in 12 years. Power is my primary training guide and HR is just a barometer for my body (higher if overheated, etc.) Everyone is different. As Luke's post suggests, it really is best to follow you heart (not necesarily with a HRM), go with what makes you happy, get advice from others, and watch yourself get faster!

I use neither powermeter, HR monitor, nor cycling computer. Not because I don't see the value of it; I just know that I'm not disciplined enough to benefit from it. You know how when people lose one of their senses, the others compensate? Yeah that's me. I'm like cycling's Stevie Wonder.

Whoa, guess everyone is a bit snippy from being cooped up and not riding outdoors all weekend...

I own a powertap (two in fact) and can understand this conversation from many perspectives. While I certainly don't think it's necessary to own a powertap/srm/ergomo to be a successful cyclist, the benefits far outweigh the costs.

If we assume that during the off season a cyclist is on his/her bike at least 12 hours a week training, and during the season upwards of 20 it becomes shockingly apparent just how much time is invested into our sport.

And as we all know time-management is crucial to the success of any non-professional cyclist for we all can't ride 6 hours a day, nor do many of us have that desire.

While it is easy to be seduced by the data and perhaps inevitable to some degree, the data will allow a cyclist who has the interest, drive and capacity to learn how to train more effectively thus saving not only massive amounts of time but maximizing the value of the time invested.

During a race it's irrelevant if one is at LT, or V02 or in zone 4 or outputting 5.3w/kg... In a race it's about winning and winning any way possible (provided it's safe and legal...) Training however is the opposite- it's all about zones, levels, efforts, intervals...etc...

As a cat 5 I didn't have a powertap and I didn't get one until I clawed my way to the 3's. Perhaps if I had spent my money on a powertap as a 5 instead of race wheels, a fancy frame, Dura-ace instead of Ultegra, etc... I would have been a 3 sooner... Now that I use a powertap consistently I am in full control of my training, I know what I'm doing and why, how to get where I want to be and which path with be the most effective.

Through learning about training I have decided upon a motto that I believe sums up an appropriate attitude towards cycling, racing, training...

Train with science, race with art.™

* for licensing and franchising opportunities associated with said motto please contact my attorneys Dewey Cheatem & Howe for details.

CBR nerds:

Don't discount the athletes (nerds) that love analyzing power data the way that some people like to knit, or paint, or bake bread. It's what they love.

JT: Spot on. I say race. Race everything. Have fun. Go hard. Then, when you feel like it, enlist the help of a plan (or coach or mentor)... develop a season-long plan. Incorporate the tools of the trade that you can afford. But your formal education into racing (that is what we do) will come in the first years when you're trying to navigate the midwest bike racing scenery. We really do have a rich scene here and I hope people are proud of that.

Power is the ticket (I use HR as I cant justify the $ with 2 of us in the house that race) and it's exciting to see what is happening to these "reagular-old-age-group" athletes that are training with some really sophisticated technology. Races should get faster and athletes stronger, right? But to benifit from all the new-found strength you still need the miles of racing. So have fun and get your licences now. Pony up!

JB: Well put, as well.

Meshberg Out

Cycling: it's like poetry in motion with Stevie Wonder at the front of the pack with a powertap and heart rate numbers floating deep into the sky.

Cycling and lifting weight. I think it's hard to improve on your training without knowing the weight or wattages you're putting in.

I don't go to the gym and try to find a 'heavy' weight to lift, I lift a certain percentage of my max a certain number of times. Same thing with cycling, intervals and training rides are based on my maxes wattages and are repeated a certain number of times for a given duration. Power helps me structure my training which helps me get stronger.

When I race...it doesn't matter what I can lift or what my threshold is as long as I get those USCF upgrade points. I just make sure I get myself fit enough to be competitive.

A beginning cyclist doesn't need a powermeter, but at the higher levels it becomes an important tool to improve fitness and and fitness helps gets more results.

First off, any feedback is helpful, and that's what HRM, power, or just plain old RPE (rate of perceived exertion are: forms of feedback.

I use a HRM for training, and while useful, I find it's double edged sword. Yes it helps gauge your efforts and keeps you contained, most helpful when accumulating base mileage, or limiting your workload. But sometimes on a team ride or race, I get excited to pull at the front, or there are other contributing factors, and a HRM gets in the way - it's feedback you don't need at the time. I would back off when I didn't need to. Once I finished up this season - and had lots of time to ride in between jobs this fall - I rode without for 3 months - just going on RPE. I found I got much more in tune with my body and effort, and I was the most focused I'd been on rides all year.

I am back on the HRM for base mileage this winter - and with my newly developed sense of RPE, I'm able to cross-reference that with the feedback from the HRM. Same goes for the powermeter. The more data you have, the clearer the picture. But sometimes it all just gets in the way, and keeps us from hearing what our body is really trying to tell us.

I'm going to revert back to my original, uncommitted comments that when it's race time, race your race, and, if you're interested in a HRM or power meter for training, there are benefits to each monitor that I saw (read above). In the end, you make your own decision based on what's most important to you.

However, in the interest of full disclosure, here's what Joe Friel has to say on the matter (if he's your coach, you have to have one): http://www.ultrafit.com/newsletter/february07.html

I declare the Chicagoland Great Training Device Debate of 2008 officially closed with a three way tie between the wattage acronym spewing nerds, the 1990's revivalists Heart Rate Monitor gurus, and the hippie commune of "it's all about how it feels, dude."

Closed, that is, until the next inevitable winter boredom forum flair up!

Sunglasses inside helmet straps vs. outside ... Fight!

outside.

Without question. Outside.

Inside!

one side in, one side out

Prologue TT helmets with visors or without?

I actually wear mine outside, but I use my HRM chest strap instead of helmet straps and I prefer to use my powertap to measure the tension on said strap (at least that is how the salesman at Performance told me it worked...)

inside, but i don't know why...it's just how i feel

This should not even be a debate, outside. How do you expect me to pull off the pink/gold or white skin-suit if you are not able to see all the side of my sunglasses? point made. Don't mean to call anyone out, but Ed, let's get em on the outside.

Outside. Otherwise your sunglass sponsor gets pissed

This is what happens when there's no 'hump day links,' Luke. Hope you're happy! This is why we can't have nice things.

Yea, No hump day links............. My heart skipped a beat. Where is the boss? Vacation I hope

Sorry fellas! I've had quite a few things on my plate these days. But I have a back log of links, tips and even an interview. Stay tuned!

This is why we should all watch what we hope for. Your the hottest thing............... people know who you are and expect things for nothing from you : )

Actually you are doing a kick ass job and have a great resource for the cycling community. Just don't miss too many link days. That would mean I would have to train on wednesday instead of reading my hump day links.

this was all a buzzkill after I had a laugh a second at bikesnob - my heart rate was considerably up while I laughed my way through the posts, it went down considerably reading these replies but it went up again knowing that i fall in the middle of the funny debatelikatmosfere.

luke - nice yellow tandem g - the guys and I ogled it and agree that you should put a rack on it to hold two cases of brew and ride along side the team ride to provide brews. please.